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pullmoll
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Senseless connection?
#210014 - 01/01/10 10:26 PM


In the schematics of Atari Space Race (http://discrete.mameworld.info/Atari/Spacerace/SpaceRace.pdf) there is on the second sheet in the area A/B and 3/4 a net of 4 connections to only inputs of gates. F3 pin 2+3, D4 pin 9 and H1 pin 1.

Does anyone have an idea what could be missing here? A signal name or a connection - to what signal?

My best guess is that the carry output of E5 (pin 15) should go to this net, while it seems unlikely the little piece of line was missed. Any other ideas?

Juergen

Edited by pullmoll (01/01/10 10:31 PM)



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Re: Senseless connection? new [Re: pullmoll]
#210020 - 01/01/10 11:27 PM


------
In the schematics of Atari Space Race (http://discrete.mameworld.info/Atari/Spacerace/SpaceRace.pdf) there is on the second sheet in the area A/B and 3/4 a net of 4 connections to only inputs of gates. F3 pin 2+3, D4 pin 9 and H1 pin 1.

Does anyone have an idea what could be missing here? A signal name or a connection - to what signal?

My best guess is that the carry output of E5 (pin 15) should go to this net, while it seems unlikely the little piece of line was missed. Any other ideas?
-------------




I forgot that the schematics I have are blue print copies of the actual hand-drawn (first version print?), but thankfully E5 (pin 15) shows the connection compared to Atari's reprinted schematics.

The E5 (ic 9316) is the same for both Space Race and Asteroid schematics.



Going over schematics here on hand.

----------
On Atari Space Race schematics (Al's hand drawn schematics): The ic 9316 E5 (pin 15) connection appears to lead to 6th pin? (IC 7402) E4 on on pcb.



On Midway Asteroid schematics: The ic 9316 E5 (pin 15) connection appears to lead to 3rd pin? (IC 7402) F3 on pcb.
---------



Taking another look at the current online (second reprint?) of Space Race schematics, they look closer to Midway Asteroid schematics compared to the hand drawn, original first draft print of Atari Space Race schematics.

Edited by gregf (01/01/10 11:39 PM)



pullmoll
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Re: Senseless connection? new [Re: gregf]
#210021 - 01/01/10 11:37 PM


> ----------
> On Atari Space Race schematics (Al's hand drawn schematics): The ic 9316 E5 (pin 15)
> connection appears to lead to 6th pin? (IC 7402) E4 on on pcb.

E4 pin 6 is already in use, so that's impossible.

>
> On Midway Asteroid schematics: The ic 9316 E5 (pin 15) connection appears to lead to
> 3rd pin? (IC 7402) F3 on pcb.

This could make sense. I'll stick with this for now and once the circuit comes to life, we'll see if it was right.

Juergen

Edited by pullmoll (01/01/10 11:40 PM)



gregf
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adjustable settings descriptions new [Re: pullmoll]
#210023 - 01/01/10 11:56 PM






> ----------
> On Atari Space Race schematics (Al's hand drawn schematics): The ic 9316 E5 (pin 15)
> connection appears to lead to 6th pin? (IC 7402) E4 on on pcb.

>E4 pin 6 is already in use, so that's impossible.

The schematics date shows 2-16-73. Maybe a mistake there when that was first drawn?

It needs to be scanned, that's for sure.


---
> On Midway Asteroid schematics: The ic 9316 E5 (pin 15) connection appears to lead to
> 3rd pin? (IC 7402) F3 on pcb.
---


>This could make sense. I'll stick with this for now and once the circuit comes to life,
> we'll see if it was right.

Okay. I look forward to visual, screen snap demo later. :-)




On Midway Asteroid trouble shooting attachment for operator adjustments as literally from the page:


-----
A. 100K fuel line calibration pot: Is preset at factory to exhaust fuel line at game over. Never change the setting of this control.

B. 1 Meg length of play pot: Determines the rate at which the fuel line expires. This control may be adjusted from 1 1/2 minutes (minimum) to 5 minutes (maximum). To increase the length of play time Rotate pot as indicated above. [arrow direction points to right]


C. Coin Control switch:

1. Switch in bottom position allows 1 play per coin

2. Switch in top position allows 2 plays per coin.

--------



pullmoll
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Another bug in the schematics. new [Re: pullmoll]
#210056 - 01/02/10 11:47 AM


While checking my netlist, it occurs there's a bug in the "ROCKET WINDOW" section of the schematics.

C6 (7420) pin 8 is once used to describe an input (from J6 pin 12) and once to describe an output (to D6 pin 9).
The pin is really an output, so the # tag on the input has to be wrong.

Of the 7420 pin 9 isn't used, so this is the # that belongs there in the schematics sheet 2 area C/6.

@gregf: can you perhaps confirm?



pullmoll
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Yet another bug. new [Re: pullmoll]
#210057 - 01/02/10 11:53 AM


In area B/5 lower left there is an inverter gate (7404) with tag E2, while E2 is really a 9316. The tag should most probably be E3 instead.



pullmoll
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Bug #4 new [Re: pullmoll]
#210059 - 01/02/10 12:17 PM


Whoa, the schematics should really be cleaned up! :-)

The tag on the inverter (7404) that inverts "CRASH 1" to "/CRASH 1" is E5, while it should be D5, because E5 is a 9316. The area is C/2 in the middle on sheet #2.



pullmoll
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Bug #5 new [Re: pullmoll]
#210060 - 01/02/10 12:43 PM


In the ROCKET WINDOW section again: the pin # 3 on the C6 (7420) is wrong. It has to be 5, because 3 is a N/C pin.
It's hard to tell if the schematics should read 5... 3 and 5 are not too different in that handwriting.



pullmoll
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First pixels drawn new [Re: pullmoll]
#210061 - 01/02/10 01:09 PM Attachment: sr.png 4 KB (1 downloads)


This isn't all too impressive yet, but it means that I have most errors squashed now. There will be a few more missing nodes in the network description: http://pmbits.ath.cx/pong/spacerace.net
The rocket is missing all pixels that were already set in the row above. That is most probably due to the open-collector outputs of the 1-of-16 decoder and the multiple connections to the inputs of the L5 (9312).

[ATTACHED IMAGE]

Attachment

Edited by pullmoll (01/02/10 01:11 PM)



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Re: Yet another bug. new [Re: pullmoll]
#210098 - 01/03/10 01:05 AM




>In area B/5 lower left there is an inverter gate (7404) with tag E2, while E2 is really
> a 9316. The tag should most probably be E3 instead.

I don't have Space Race/Asteroid pcb myself, but I will go with what is printed on General Instructions (pages stapled together), in trouble shooting sections pages:

E-2 is 9316

E-3 is 7404



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Re: Bug #4 *edit* new [Re: pullmoll]
#210100 - 01/03/10 01:19 AM


>Whoa, the schematics should really be cleaned up! :-)

Actually, I would go with getting my Space Race paperwork (General instructions and troubleshooting pages) scanned asap and uploaded to various sites even though I will guess Space Race / Asteroid pcbs aren't being repaired as much these days.

Your schematics drawing bugs should be documented in the driver file and also mentioned on Discrete Logistics or any other sites that could make use of your findings.


btw: I noticed a couple of odd differences between Asteroid General Instructions versus Asteroid logic schematics. And it looks as though the hand drawn Space Race blue print sheets have 566 being used instead of NE 555, but that was probably before Space Race pcbs were in full production and placed into Space Race cabs.

>The tag on the inverter (7404) that inverts "CRASH 1" to "/CRASH 1" is E5, while it
> should be D5, because E5 is a 9316. The area is C/2 in the middle on sheet #2.

General Instructions pages, in trouble shooting section have:

E-5 is 9316

D-5 is 7404


Midway Asteroid has a "D-?" indicated and I can't tell what number it is because it is in a folded part in which numer isn't readable.

On the hand drawn Space Race blue print sheet, it looks as if someone wrote over in pencil with "D" so as to prevent any confusion.

Edited by gregf (01/03/10 02:15 AM)



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Re: Bug #5 new [Re: pullmoll]
#210102 - 01/03/10 01:28 AM




>In the ROCKET WINDOW section again: the pin # 3 on the C6 (7420) is wrong. It has to be
> 5, because 3 is a N/C pin.

>It's hard to tell if the schematics should read 5... 3 and 5 are not too different in
> that handwriting.


Midway Asteroids schematics is bit more readable with a 5.

As for the hand drawn Space Race blueprints (dated 2/16/73), not online yet, suffer same fate as you describe.



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Re: First pixels drawn new [Re: pullmoll]
#210106 - 01/03/10 01:33 AM





>This isn't all too impressive yet,

It's a good start just seeing a visible image in quite some time.



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Re: Another bug in the schematics. new [Re: pullmoll]
#210108 - 01/03/10 01:59 AM




----------
While checking my netlist, it occurs there's a bug in the "ROCKET WINDOW" section of the schematics.

C6 (7420) pin 8 is once used to describe an input (from J6 pin 12) and once to describe an output (to D6 pin 9).
The pin is really an output, so the # tag on the input has to be wrong.

Of the 7420 pin 9 isn't used, so this is the # that belongs there in the schematics sheet 2 area C/6.
--------

Both schematics I have agree with you. J-6 (7427) to C-6 (7420) is 9, not 8.



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Re: First pixels drawn new [Re: pullmoll]
#210111 - 01/03/10 02:59 AM


> This isn't all too impressive yet, but it means that I have most errors squashed now.
> There will be a few more missing nodes in the network description:
> http://pmbits.ath.cx/pong/spacerace.net
> The rocket is missing all pixels that were already set in the row above. That is most
> probably due to the open-collector outputs of the 1-of-16 decoder and the multiple
> connections to the inputs of the L5 (9312).

On the contrary, it's extremely impressive. I know at a medium level how discrete games work, so I'm pretty impressed by what you're doing.



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Re: First pixels drawn new [Re: R. Belmont]
#210119 - 01/03/10 04:12 AM


> > This isn't all too impressive yet, but it means that I have most errors squashed
> now.
> > There will be a few more missing nodes in the network description:
> > http://pmbits.ath.cx/pong/spacerace.net
> > The rocket is missing all pixels that were already set in the row above. That is
> most
> > probably due to the open-collector outputs of the 1-of-16 decoder and the multiple
> > connections to the inputs of the L5 (9312).
>
> On the contrary, it's extremely impressive. I know at a medium level how discrete
> games work, so I'm pretty impressed by what you're doing.

Totally agree. I don't think people quite understand the level of what is being done. I'm searching for a good analogy, but I can't think of one that cleanly relates.



pullmoll
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Re: First pixels drawn new [Re: gregf]
#210123 - 01/03/10 04:35 AM


> > This isn't all too impressive yet,
>
> It's a good start just seeing a visible image in quite some time.

Well, and now it's gone, because I could not yet get the coin and start sections right. This is a little tricky, because I haven't emulated a switch input, but a blackbox with Q and /Q outputs for coin and start buttons... I have to rethink this part.

Anyway, it was fun to see that image from the PCB on the LC display :-)



pullmoll
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Re: First pixels drawn new [Re: R. Belmont]
#210124 - 01/03/10 04:40 AM


> On the contrary, it's extremely impressive. I know at a medium level how discrete
> games work, so I'm pretty impressed by what you're doing.

Years of fun "playing" discrete games will arise when anyone can turn a schematic into a netlist and run it in MAME. I just sincerely hope that Moore's law isn't obsolete yet.



pullmoll
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Re: Bug #5 new [Re: gregf]
#210125 - 01/03/10 04:43 AM


> > In the ROCKET WINDOW section again: the pin # 3 on the > Midway Asteroids schematics is bit more readable with a 5.
>
> As for the hand drawn Space Race blueprints (dated 2/16/73), not online yet, suffer
> same fate as you describe.

Thank you for verifying my findings! And yes, these should be appended to the original schematics as a list of known bugs.

It's funny how comparably easy it is with todays tools to detect this kind of bugs in ancient schematics.



pullmoll
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Re: Bug #4 *edit* new [Re: gregf]
#210126 - 01/03/10 04:51 AM


> btw: I noticed a couple of odd differences between Asteroid General Instructions
> versus Asteroid logic schematics. And it looks as though the hand drawn Space Race
> blue print sheets have 566 being used instead of NE 555, but that was probably before
> Space Race pcbs were in full production and placed into Space Race cabs.

Hold on! The 555 and 566 are completely different parts, even if both have the same package (8 pin DIP) and power pins (8 and 1). The 566 is a voltage controllable oscillator while the 555 can be used as mono-flop or rate generator, depending on the external circuitry.

> Midway Asteroid has a "D-?" indicated and I can't tell what number it is because it
> is in a folded part in which numer isn't readable.

Fortunately a working Space Race, once it happens, will solve such kind of questions.

> On the hand drawn Space Race blue print sheet, it looks as if someone wrote over in
> pencil with "D" so as to prevent any confusion.

Confused am I, break taking must now I, good year wish I. *off*



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Space Race / Asteroid paperwork comparisons 555 and 566 new [Re: pullmoll]
#210153 - 01/03/10 09:43 AM


-------
> btw: I noticed a couple of odd differences between Asteroid General Instructions
> versus Asteroid logic schematics. And it looks as though the hand drawn Space Race
> blue print sheets have 566 being used instead of NE 555, but that was probably before
> Space Race pcbs were in full production and placed into Space Race cabs.
--------


> Hold on! The 555 and 566 are completely different parts, even if both have the same
> package (8 pin DIP) and power pins (8 and 1). The 566 is a voltage controllable
> oscillator while the 555 can be used as mono-flop or rate generator, depending on the
> external circuitry.

I messed up and got part numbers incorrect. 566 is audio related. My bad.

I did a comparison with all Space Race / Asteroid paperwork on hand.



One trouble shooting attachment by itself....maybe a preliminary print?

A-3 NE 555
A-4 NE 555
A-6 NE 555
A-9 NE 555
B-4 NE 555
C-4 NE 555
C-9 NE 555
D-9 NE 555



These look more reliable imo.

General instructions with troubleshooting section and parts layout page

A-3 NE 555
A-4 NE 555 <-- is printed, but parts layout and logic schematics have 566.
A-6 NE 566
A-9 NE 555
B-4 NE 566
B-6 NE 555
C-4 NE 566
C-9 NE 555
D-9 NE 555


Midway Asteroid logic schematics

A-3 NE 555
A-4 NE 566
A-6 NE 555
A-9 NE 555
B-4 NE 566
B-6 NE 555
C-4 NE 566
C-9 NE 555
D-9 NE 555



Atari Space Race hand drawn logic schematics

A-3 NE 555
A-4 NE 566
A-6 NE 555
A-9 NE 555
B-4 NE 566
B-6 NE 555
C-4 NE 566
C-9 NE 555
D-9 NE 555



pullmoll
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Re: Space Race / Asteroid paperwork comparisons 555 and 566 new [Re: gregf]
#210155 - 01/03/10 01:04 PM


> One trouble shooting attachment by itself....maybe a preliminary print?
>
> A-3 NE 555
> A-4 NE 555
> A-6 NE 555
> A-9 NE 555
> B-4 NE 555
> C-4 NE 555
> C-9 NE 555
> D-9 NE 555

This is definitely wrong. I guess someone was in a hurry when he wrote that



pullmoll
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Questionable tags on crash detection. new [Re: pullmoll]
#210156 - 01/03/10 01:07 PM


In the area C/3 on sheet 2 there are two similar sections to detect the CRASH1 and CRASH2 signals. However D3 pin 9 and D3 pin 5 shall - according to the schematics - _both_ be connected to 256H! That's senseless, because then both CRASH signals would always occur together. One of both has to be /256H, probably that of player1 (left).



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Re: First pixels drawn new [Re: italie]
#210168 - 01/03/10 05:33 PM


> > On the contrary, it's extremely impressive. I know at a medium level how discrete
> > games work, so I'm pretty impressed by what you're doing.
>
> Totally agree. I don't think people quite understand the level of what is being done.
> I'm searching for a good analogy, but I can't think of one that cleanly relates.

we'll happily take a dirty reference. probably everyone here has their HDD full of porn anyway, so we'll all feel right at home



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Hang on... new [Re: pullmoll]
#210169 - 01/03/10 05:36 PM


Is this for MAME or something?
If so, how would you supply the games considering there are no rom chips? Just curious.

And i'm just asking if it is or isnt.



----
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Re: Bug #4 *edit* new [Re: pullmoll]
#210171 - 01/03/10 05:38 PM


> Confused am I, break taking must now I, good year wish I. *off*

I figured anyone that can take on a project like converting a discrete game from schematics and getting it [partly] emulated so quickly must be a Jedi. That proves it, Master Yoda



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Re: Hang on... new [Re: Naoki]
#210172 - 01/03/10 05:42 PM


> Is this for MAME or something?
> If so, how would you supply the games considering there are no rom chips? Just
> curious.
>
> And i'm just asking if it is or isnt.

if you read the other posts you'll see it's done via a net list. that's discrete talk for a big list of chips and their associated connections.
if you want to see another example, download Dice and check the source code. I'm sure someone will be along shortly to give you a link to it. Assuming someone out there cares



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Re: Hang on... new [Re: TheGuru]
#210174 - 01/03/10 06:14 PM


> > Is this for MAME or something?
> > If so, how would you supply the games considering there are no rom chips? Just
> > curious.
> >
> > And i'm just asking if it is or isnt.
>
> if you read the other posts you'll see it's done via a net list. that's discrete talk
> for a big list of chips and their associated connections.
> if you want to see another example, download Dice and check the source code. I'm sure
> someone will be along shortly to give you a link to it. Assuming someone out there
> cares

Ahh.



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Re: Yet another bug. new [Re: gregf]
#210177 - 01/03/10 07:14 PM Attachment: Midway Asteroid.zip 5424 KB (9 downloads)


I got a Midway Asteroid board but it's missing a few chips (15 to be exact). I'm attaching pictures of it. (I just took them outside but unfortunately I'm experiencing a cloudy day.) Hopefully this will prove somewhat useful.



Kevin Eshbach



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Re: Hang on... new [Re: Naoki]
#210191 - 01/03/10 08:52 PM


> > > Is this for MAME or something?
> > > If so, how would you supply the games considering there are no rom chips? Just
> > > curious.
> > >
> > > And i'm just asking if it is or isnt.
> >
> > if you read the other posts you'll see it's done via a net list. that's discrete
> talk
> > for a big list of chips and their associated connections.
> > if you want to see another example, download Dice and check the source code. I'm
> sure
> > someone will be along shortly to give you a link to it. Assuming someone out there
> > cares
>
> Ahh.

Yeah, see my post here: http://www.mameworld.info/ubbthreads/sho...part=1&vc=1

Turns out I was wrong about people not working on it.

As for DICE:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/dice/files/

And his blog, before Real Life set in...
http://adamulation.blogspot.com/

- Stiletto

Edited by Stiletto (01/03/10 08:59 PM)



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Re: Hang on... new [Re: Stiletto]
#210204 - 01/03/10 11:04 PM


> > > > Is this for MAME or something?
> > > > If so, how would you supply the games considering there are no rom chips? Just
> > > > curious.
> > > >
> > > > And i'm just asking if it is or isnt.
> > >
> > > if you read the other posts you'll see it's done via a net list. that's discrete
> > talk
> > > for a big list of chips and their associated connections.
> > > if you want to see another example, download Dice and check the source code. I'm
> > sure
> > > someone will be along shortly to give you a link to it. Assuming someone out
> there
> > > cares
> >
> > Ahh.
>
> Yeah, see my post here:
> http://www.mameworld.info/ubbthreads/sho...part=1&vc=1
>
> Turns out I was wrong about people not working on it.
>
> As for DICE:
> http://sourceforge.net/projects/dice/files/
>
> And his blog, before Real Life set in...
> http://adamulation.blogspot.com/
>
> - Stiletto

I thought that you might have done schem files if there were no roms. ^_^

But since when dowes MAMEdev distribute roms through "usual channels"? I thought you had to go to rom sites or download torrents for that....



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Re: First pixels drawn new [Re: R. Belmont]
#210219 - 01/04/10 12:59 AM


> > This isn't all too impressive yet,
>
> On the contrary, it's extremely impressive.

I agree.

I've wanted to play with something like this for a while, but real life keeps getting in the way. I had some basic ideas on what needed to be done, but you took it waaaay further than that.

I dig the xml netlist, and driving everything from the top-level CLK, VCC and GND.
And I like the per-chip TTL functions you've implemented. I understand your code much better than looking at an old, fuzzy and badly copied datasheet (and they usually have errors too!).

It won't win any speed competitions, but that's not really the point.

It's awesome to see some life spring up out of a netlist.

Good luck with it!

H@P



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Re: Senseless connection? new [Re: pullmoll]
#210225 - 01/04/10 01:56 AM


Wow, nice to see someone else taking up the discrete emulation torch!

Interesting choice of Space Race, that was one game I tried to add to DICE back in the day but was never able to get it working fully. If I recall, I think I got everything except the stars circuit working properly. I wasn't sure if it was due to all the errors in the schematics (I found most of the same ones), or if it was due to inaccuracies with the simulation - I was using unit gate delay, so every single chip had the exact same delay, which was accurate enough for Pong, but probably not accurate enough for the more complex games. What kind of method are you using for the gate delays? I always planned on starting over from scratch with a more accurate and faster simulator, but never got around to it. So I'll be interested to see if you're actually able to get this working.

And what kind of speed are you getting?


Adam



pullmoll
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Re: Senseless connection? new [Re: AdamB]
#210236 - 01/04/10 03:52 AM


> Interesting choice of Space Race, that was one game I tried to add to DICE back in
> the day but was never able to get it working fully.

Hiya,
well, it looks like it's causing trouble for me, too. Currently I don't get any video signal, not even the score display. The 9602 emulation also seems to be very broken, because neither stars nor the vertical line at 256H appear.

> What kind of method are you using for the
> gate delays?

I have the different delays for the 0->1 and 1->0 transitions from a TTL data book. Most delays are for the SN74xxx types, i.e. the earliest chips, except when there are only 74LSxxx or other newer types.

> And what kind of speed are you getting?

Pong runs at roughly 4 fps on my Phenom X4 2.3GHz. It of course runs on one CPU only, and I'm thinking about ways to distribute the work load across multiple cores...

Juergen



gregf
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Re: Questionable tags on crash detection - schematics have new [Re: pullmoll]
#210242 - 01/04/10 05:52 AM




>In the area C/3 on sheet 2 there are two similar sections to detect the CRASH1 and
> CRASH2 signals. However D3 pin 9 and D3 pin 5 shall - according to the schematics -
> _both_ be connected to 256H! That's senseless, because then both CRASH signals would
> always occur together. One of both has to be /256H, probably that of player1 (left).


Another misprint find there on your part.



Atari Space Race hand drawn schematics over here have:

(ic 7400) D-3

pin 9 /256H

pin 3 256H


Midway Asteroid schematics have it printed slightly different

pin 9 H-7-6 / ( divided by symbol 1024x)

pin 3 ( divided by symbol 1024x) / H-7-5



pullmoll
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Re: Questionable tags on crash detection - schematics have new [Re: gregf]
#210244 - 01/04/10 05:58 AM


Great. Thank you!



AdamB
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Re: Senseless connection? new [Re: pullmoll]
#210251 - 01/04/10 07:20 AM


> Hiya,
> well, it looks like it's causing trouble for me, too. Currently I don't get any video
> signal, not even the score display. The 9602 emulation also seems to be very broken,
> because neither stars nor the vertical line at 256H appear.

I took a few minutes to compare your net-list to the one I was using and noticed a few differences:

- Pin 13 of L4 and pin 13 of F4 should presumably be connected to VCC, these connections weren't shown on the schematics. Depending on how your simulator works leaving these unconnected might cause those chips to be held in reset.
- I have pin 1 of D6 connected to /VRESET instead of VRESET. Don't remember how I came to this conclusion, but I specifically commented it as being an error in the schematics, so you might want to look into it.


Adam



gregf
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Re: Yet another bug. new [Re: keshbach1]
#210256 - 01/04/10 07:59 AM




>I got a Midway Asteroid board but it's missing a few chips (15 to be exact).

*newbies material* If curious, Juergen's Space Race net code also has these ics indicated within the code.





Here is what I copied from Asteroid general instructions pages. Not to be mistaken for actual Asteroid parts catalog which Midway also had printed for Asteroid cabs.


The data comes from pcb layout page because the troubleshooting section might have a couple typos.



A-1 7402
A-2 9316
A-3 NE 555
A-4 566

A-6 NE 555
A-7 7400
A-8 7474
A-9 NE 555

B-1 7400
B-2 9316
B-3 7474
B-4 566

B-6 NE 555
B-7 7402
B-8 7474
B-9 7404

C-1 7427
C-2 74107
C-3 7493
C-4 566

C-6 7420
C-7 7474
C-8 7410
C-9 NE 555

D-1 7493
D-2 9316
D-3 7400
D-4 7400
D-5 7404
D-6 7400
D-7 7404
D-8 7400
D-9 NE 555

E-1 7474
E-2 9316
E-3 7404
E-4 7402
E-5 9316
E-6 7410
E-7 7427
E-8 7410
E-9 7404

F-2 7400
F-3 7402
F-4 74107
F-5 9316
F-6 7493
F-7 7474
F-8 7410
F-9 7430


H-1 7410
H-2 7474
H-3 9316
H-4 9322

H-6 7493
H-7 74107
H-8 7410
H-9 7490

J-2 7400
J-3 9316
J-4 74154 K-4

J-6 7427
J-7 7430
J-8 7448
J-9 7490


K-2 7474
K-3 9316
K-4 74154 J-4

K-6 7410
K-7 7493
K-8 74153
K-9 7490

L-2 7400
L-3 9316
L-4 9602
L-5 9312
L-6 7486
L-7 7493
L-8 74153
L-9 7490



Any numbers missing happen to be because no chips are in location on the Space Race/Asteroid pcb.



pullmoll
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Re: Senseless connection? new [Re: AdamB]
#210263 - 01/04/10 03:27 PM Attachment: sr.png 5 KB (0 downloads)


> - Pin 13 of L4 and pin 13 of F4 should presumably be connected to VCC, these
> connections weren't shown on the schematics. Depending on how your simulator works
> leaving these unconnected might cause those chips to be held in reset.

Good catch! I already had found Pin 13 of F4 using the unconnected pins list, but L4.13 escaped me. Now there's something like a star field.

> - I have pin 1 of D6 connected to /VRESET instead of VRESET. Don't remember how I
> came to this conclusion, but I specifically commented it as being an error in the
> schematics, so you might want to look into it.

I'll take a look. The coin/reset and start section is somewhat awkward, because it's mixed with analog parts...

[ATTACHED IMAGE]

Attachment



gregf
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Re: Senseless connection? new [Re: pullmoll]
#210287 - 01/04/10 11:07 PM



>> - Pin 13 of L4 and pin 13 of F4 should presumably be connected to VCC, these
>> connections weren't shown on the schematics. Depending on how your simulator works
>> leaving these unconnected might cause those chips to be held in reset.

>Good catch! I already had found Pin 13 of F4 using the unconnected pins list, but L4.13
> escaped me.

I couldn't find anything on either Midway Asteroid and Atari Space Race hand drawn schematics.



>Now there's something like a star field.

Outstanding.

This is great seeing a somewhat more complete looking screen.



>The coin/reset and start section is somewhat awkward, because it's mixed with analog
> parts...

Good luck with this part.



casm
Cinematronics > *
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Re: First pixels drawn new [Re: R. Belmont]
#210293 - 01/04/10 11:41 PM


> > This isn't all too impressive yet,

> On the contrary, it's extremely impressive.

I just wanted to add a 'me too' statement to this. It's some of the most amazing stuff I've seen in emulation in a long time, and I'm incredibly impressed with the progress that's been made here in just a few days.

My hat's off to everyone involved. Discrete emulation really fascinates me and to see it advancing as it is is just... Awesome.



keshbach1
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Re: Senseless connection? new [Re: pullmoll]
#210302 - 01/05/10 01:14 AM


I can verify some of the connections against my Midway Asteroid board, but all I ask is for somebody to type all the questions into one post so I can print it out instead of me trying to track down and print out 50 billion posts.



Kevin Eshbach



keshbach1
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Posts: 1303
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Re: Yet another bug. new [Re: gregf]
#210393 - 01/05/10 10:51 PM Attachment: Asteroid Parts.zip 667 KB (3 downloads)


I entered the chips from my Midway Asteroid into my homegrown database that I use to keep track of what a board uses (along with other information) and took snapshots because I don't have an easy way of exporting the data into a text file just yet.


Kevin Eshbach



Brian Deuel
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Re: First pixels drawn new [Re: pullmoll]
#217291 - 03/19/10 06:55 AM


VERY impressive. I know I don't get around these parts too often anymore, but this work (and DICE) is the realization of a long-standing dream of mine. Good luck along this long, winding road...



"One of these days, I'm going to cut you into little pieces!"- Nick Mason, Pink Floyd



StilettoAdministrator
They're always after me Lucky ROMS!
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bump. *nt* new [Re: Brian Deuel]
#243108 - 01/08/11 08:08 PM


> VERY impressive. I know I don't get around these parts too often anymore, but this
> work (and DICE) is the realization of a long-standing dream of mine. Good luck along
> this long, winding road...

Need to buy myself some time.

One thread has been deleted...



TafoidAdministrator
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Re: bump. *nt* new [Re: Stiletto]
#280700 - 03/28/12 02:09 AM


> > VERY impressive. I know I don't get around these parts too often anymore, but this
> > work (and DICE) is the realization of a long-standing dream of mine. Good luck
> along
> > this long, winding road...
>
> Need to buy myself some time.
>
> One thread has been deleted...

Further bumping. 1 year limits are weeeeeeeeeeeeeak!



Sune
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Re: Hang on... new [Re: Naoki]
#280702 - 03/28/12 02:46 AM


> But since when dowes MAMEdev distribute roms through "usual channels"? I thought you
> had to go to rom sites or download torrents for that....

Schematics <> ROMs.

Don't ask about these things, either you know how to read between the lines or you don't. If you don't, then please be quiet and thankful that this is happening in your lifetime.

People have left here, never to be seen again because of stupid discussions started by that type of question. So just shut up and be happy will you?

Thanks.

(yes I know this is an old thread)

S


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