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R.Coltrane
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Question about artwork Aspect Ratio
#277146 - 02/24/12 03:17 PM


I want to understand why some games have their bezels horizontaly 'stretched', like if they were displayed in a 16:9 format instead of regular 4:3 format.

One example of game that suffer from that issue is Renegade. The game's bezel is a square, but when you apply it into MAME, it becomes stretched. It appears to happen to all low-res games. Another example is Ghosts'N Goblins.



What can I do to fix that issue? I've tried different values in the .lay file but without success. A hint here would be great. I'm using it with a 19" LCD monitor configured at 1440x900 32bpp @60hz.



Mr. DoAdministrator
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Re: Question about artwork Aspect Ratio new [Re: R.Coltrane]
#277151 - 02/24/12 06:18 PM



Post your mame.ini fil here, something must be set wrong.

Assuming that whole black area is your screen, there's something really wrong, as the bezel should be touching the top and bottom of your screen.




RELAX and just have fun. Remember, it's all about the games.




R.Coltrane
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Re: Question about artwork Aspect Ratio new [Re: Mr. Do]
#277162 - 02/24/12 09:07 PM Attachment: mame.ini 5 KB (2 downloads)


I don't know if it's something related to mame.ini, because I've removed it and the game is still wrong. What puzzles me here is that Pit-Fighter is working properly, see below:



I've attached my mame.ini here anyway. Please take a look and see if there's a clue inside.



R.Coltrane
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Re: Question about artwork Aspect Ratio new [Re: R.Coltrane]
#277166 - 02/24/12 09:18 PM Attachment: renegade.ini 8 KB (0 downloads)


Here I've attached the renegade.ini that is generated by QMC2MAME, a frontend I'm currently using. Maybe the frontend is causing the undesired stretch.

The same thing occurs to another game I did the bezel myself from the BYOAC CAG scan (P.O.W.). See below:




Mr. DoAdministrator
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Re: Question about artwork Aspect Ratio new [Re: R.Coltrane]
#277172 - 02/24/12 10:39 PM


> Here I've attached the renegade.ini that is generated by QMC2MAME, a frontend I'm
> currently using. Maybe the frontend is causing the undesired stretch.
>
> The same thing occurs to another game I did the bezel myself from the BYOAC CAG scan
> (P.O.W.). See below:


That's weird; I don't know why one works, and the other two don't (not at home right now, so I can't test).

Question, though: I'm curious as to why you're using ddraw (rather than d3d), and in combination with that, you're not using hwstretch. That combination of the two is ususally for playing on an arcade monitor.




RELAX and just have fun. Remember, it's all about the games.




R.Coltrane
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Reged: 08/07/05
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Re: Question about artwork Aspect Ratio new [Re: Mr. Do]
#277182 - 02/25/12 12:01 AM


> Question, though: I'm curious as to why you're using ddraw (rather than d3d), and in
> combination with that, you're not using hwstretch. That combination of the two is
> ususally for playing on an arcade monitor.

Only because I really love the 1:1 square-pixel-perfect screen that currently only ddraw can deliver with sharp, crisp and clear image quality. DDraw always makes the screen blurred when you use it together with hardware stretch, and I really hate that blurry 'side effect'. Regarding D3D, if you try to use it with 1:1 'pixel-perfect' screen resolution, you will notice lines with different degrees of thickness on your game's screen and believe me, if you look closer, you will find at least one. This is a 'distortion' of the game image. So, you can only use D3D with 4:3 aspect ratio to get a decent image quality.

Actually, you gave me a clue here because in-game artworks are better with D3D and 4:3 aspect ratio, it's a lot faster than ddraw. But for pure gaming experience without artworks, I will stick with DDraw by far.



StilettoAdministrator
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Re: Question about artwork Aspect Ratio new [Re: R.Coltrane]
#277185 - 02/25/12 12:21 AM


> Only because I really love the square-pixel-perfect screen that currently only ddraw
> can deliver with sharp, crisp and clear image quality. D3D always makes the screen
> blurred when you use it together with hardware stretch, and I really hate that blurry
> 'side effect'.

Bilinear filtering. You can disable this, but the stretching artifacts become much more noticeable...

> Also, if you don't enable hws, you will notice lines with different
> degrees of thickness on your game's screen and believe me, if you look closer, you
> will find at least one. This is called by me as a 'distortion' of the original image,
> another undesired D3D side effect.

...As you notice.

"SDLMAME" has a feature called -ues (or unevenstretch) - defaults to on, but you can set to disabled (-nounevenstretch) and then get 1:1 pixels with integer stretching. The downside to this is you will get windowboxing effects when it's not an exact integer stretch.

You can acquire a Windows binary of "SDLMAME" sometimes, or build one yourself with the usual compiling tools and official MAME source. (Technically you shouldn't call it SDLMAME any more since it became part of the actual MAME project...)

I've often wanted this as a feature in standard MAME.

- Stiletto



R.Coltrane
MAME user since 0.11
Reged: 08/07/05
Posts: 486
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Re: Question about artwork Aspect Ratio new [Re: Stiletto]
#277187 - 02/25/12 12:37 AM


> "SDLMAME" has a feature called -ues (or unevenstretch) - defaults to on, but you can
> set to disabled (-nounevenstretch) and then get 1:1 pixels with integer stretching.
> The downside to this is you will get windowboxing effects when it's not an exact
> integer stretch.
>
> You can acquire a Windows binary of "SDLMAME" sometimes, or build one yourself with
> the usual compiling tools and official MAME source. (Technically you shouldn't call
> it SDLMAME any more since it became part of the actual MAME project...)
>
> I've often wanted this as a feature in standard MAME.
>
> - Stiletto

Thanks Stiletto, I'll give it a try later. In fact, I've made a few mistakes in my original post (fixed now, go read that again :P). Hardware stretch is a DDraw option, not D3D. I'm aware of bilinear filtering also, but as you said, it causes undesired effects if you turn it off.
And regarding D3D, it really makes the line thickness distortion as I said before, no matter which resolution/video card you use. I've tested it today with 4:3 aspect ratio and to my surprise it has a slighter better quality than 1:1, by displaying 'near-square' pixels with less distortion (but the thickness difference in some of the vertical lines are still there). But anyway, this is the best option to use together with artworks provided here. It's faster than DDraw and will fit the screen in a better way. Also, you won't notice the little distortions because the game's screen will be smaller . Thanks to Mr.DO! for the tip.

But, as I said before, for the best MAME gaming experience, I will definitely stick with DDraw, with no hws and 1:1 aspect ratio.

And Mr.DO!, don't worry about that stretched pictures I've submitted earlier today. I think they've got streched by the crappy video card I have in that specific crappy computer I was using, that I'm sure has a crappy video card. Here at home, with my Radeon HD 5770 I've got perfect non-stretched artwork and everything is working just fine. I'm really sorry about that! I really should test more options before opening my big mouth!!

Edited by Roger Coltrane (02/25/12 01:14 AM)


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