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Dullaron
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Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video)
#388717 - 11/21/20 04:38 PM




But why use very old MAME?

People need to stop using the out of date source code. A lot of roms changes/redump and source fixes isn't in the out of date source. lol



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Envisaged0ne
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: Dullaron]
#388719 - 11/21/20 06:26 PM


Uuuuummm, he explains why he used that version within the 1st minute of the video



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Dullaron
Diablo III - Dunard #1884
Reged: 07/22/05
Posts: 5892
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: Envisaged0ne]
#388721 - 11/21/20 06:29 PM


> Uuuuummm, he explains why he used that version within the 1st minute of the video

Yeah I know that. There so many ports of that version. lol

Like beating a dead horse over and over. 20 years later down into the future they still porting that version. lol



Windows 10 Home 64-bit / AMD Radeon RX 5700 XT / AMD Ryzen 7 3700X 8-Core 3.59 GHz / RAM 16 GB



gamez fan
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: Dullaron]
#388728 - 11/22/20 12:37 PM


> > Uuuuummm, he explains why he used that version within the 1st minute of the video
>
> Yeah I know that. There so many ports of that version. lol
>
> Like beating a dead horse over and over. 20 years later down into the future they
> still porting that version. lol

Life is full of "choices" you can opt for a 20 year old version of MAME warts and all
or simply opt for the vastly superior latest version.

That decision at the end of the day is upto the "users" they'll make an informed choice
around which builds they want to use on their own devices.

Oh and that core he's talking about isn't plain ole vanilla MAME72 similar to certain
other ancient cores which do the rounds there have been many code changes backported
from later MAME builds.



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StilettoAdministrator
They're always after me Lucky ROMS!
Reged: 03/07/04
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: gamez fan]
#388729 - 11/22/20 01:12 PM


> Oh and that core he's talking about isn't plain ole vanilla MAME72 similar to certain
> other ancient cores which do the rounds there have been many code changes backported
> from later MAME builds.

Well, backports from MAME 0.172+ might be a license violation, so it's always nice to know which those "modified cores" are.

- Stiletto



TrevEB
Brokering peace between the collectors and the Mame Community
Reged: 03/10/05
Posts: 713
Loc: Oakland, CA
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: Stiletto]
#388731 - 11/22/20 03:46 PM


The thing that really annoys me as a user of Mame, not a code writer is that all of these 0.72 ports leave behind support for sound samples and art.
I am sure the code to include the art and sound is all there, however Mame cannot find it, even if you place the art and samples in the correct folders when they exist.

Its likely because the people porting the program want to play MK and or Street Fighter which does not use those items so who cares right?

Its a damn shame. And all of the various items coming from China like Pandoraís box have the same problem. It also includes RetroX which does offer more recent versions of Mame but no support for art, samples, dat files etc.

TreEB



Vas Crabb
BOFH
Reged: 12/12/05
Posts: 4184
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: TrevEB]
#388738 - 11/22/20 07:00 PM


> The thing that really annoys me as a user of Mame, not a code writer is that all of
> these 0.72 ports leave behind support for sound samples and art.
> I am sure the code to include the art and sound is all there, however Mame cannot
> find it, even if you place the art and samples in the correct folders when they
> exist.

The current artwork system was introduced in 0.106u2 Ė anything older canít support it at all. There have also been a lot of improvements to artwork support in the past few months, so youíre really missing out if you arenít running up-to-date MAME.



TrevEB
Brokering peace between the collectors and the Mame Community
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: Vas Crabb]
#388745 - 11/22/20 08:23 PM


Oh trust me, Iím on... well close to the latest edition.

However that might explain why art does not load up. Perhaps if I used the old art files it would work but I know for a fact the sound samples donít work.
Nah, Iíll stick with the PC version.



gamez fan
Reged: 02/23/13
Posts: 206
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: Stiletto]
#388746 - 11/22/20 09:04 PM


> > Oh and that core he's talking about isn't plain ole vanilla MAME72 similar to
> certain
> > other ancient cores which do the rounds there have been many code changes
> backported
> > from later MAME builds.
>
> Well, backports from MAME 0.172+ might be a license violation, so it's always nice to
> know which those "modified cores" are.
>
> - Stiletto

Well that still leaves all the code pre MAME172, anyway does the MAME project
have the "funds" just lying around to waste on getting legaled up trying to enforce
something which for many is considered to be unenforceable.



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StilettoAdministrator
They're always after me Lucky ROMS!
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: gamez fan]
#388747 - 11/22/20 09:45 PM


> > > Oh and that core he's talking about isn't plain ole vanilla MAME72 similar to
> > certain
> > > other ancient cores which do the rounds there have been many code changes
> > backported
> > > from later MAME builds.
> >
> > Well, backports from MAME 0.172+ might be a license violation, so it's always nice
> to
> > know which those "modified cores" are.
> >
> > - Stiletto
>
> Well that still leaves all the code pre MAME172, anyway does the MAME project
> have the "funds" just lying around to waste on getting legaled up trying to enforce
> something which for many is considered to be unenforceable.

There's legal organizations that will protect GPL projects' licenses more or less pro bono ("for free"), or didn't you know?

That said, a lot of MAME's sourcecode is BSD licensed.

- Stiletto



R.Coltrane
MAME user since 0.11
Reged: 08/07/05
Posts: 485
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: gamez fan]
#388758 - 11/23/20 08:25 AM


> That decision at the end of the day is upto the "users" they'll make an informed
> choice
> around which builds they want to use on their own devices.

Not exactly. It's not a "users" choice to use an old build. If they had a choice, they would certainly prefer the latest version. Old versions keep being ported because there's a pre-existing source code which is more portable to different devices/OS's.

The most annoying aspect in this situation is that old romsets keep floating all around the web and they won't disappear because of such old builds, which require old romsets to work.



MooglyGuy
Renegade MAME Dev
Reged: 09/01/05
Posts: 2075
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: gamez fan]
#388759 - 11/23/20 09:19 AM


> That decision at the end of the day is upto the "users" they'll make an informed
> choice
> around which builds they want to use on their own devices.

It's been clear where you stand after years of your posts, but I should be equally clear: By and large, users don't make anything even remotely resembling an "informed choice".

In actual fact, users go for what they perceive as the path of both least resistance and maximal ignorance. In most cases, that seems to be ancient versions of MAME bundled with ROMs that they find on this or that torrent site, or whatever combo is being peddled by the latest and not-so-greatest fly-by-night websites that post individual ROM sets up for download.

These users neither know nor care about the overall aims of the MAME project throughout the years, nor about the development process, nor the rationale behind the decisions made. They care about one thing, being able to play old games for free.

In fact, you can see it all over Reddit release threads and right here at home on MAMEWorld: If you actually try to inform users as to the overall lay of the land, what they stand to benefit by upgrading, and what they're missing out on by using a decades-old build, not only do they not care, they quite often react with outward hostility to the person trying to educate them: The person laboring to help them be truly capable of making the "informed decision" that you refer to.

At the end of the day, it's not my business to judge what version of MAME a user happens to find most appropriate for their use case. But when those users become not just hostile, but openly abusive, towards the people who actually make things happen, the people who actually enable these users to relive their childhoods, for simply having the downright audacity to educate and inform them, then I will happily judge the lot.

So many of you on here love to clutch at your pearls when MAMEdevs lash back after brooking years upon years of abuse for having the temerity to not do exactly what you want, it's nauseating. At times I feel like an abused wife, being expected to bow and scrape in obsequiousness, to cook and clean exactly to the husband's liking, while getting a slap or a black eye for the apparent injustice of serving him a steak that's two degrees too hot, or god forbid, two degrees too cold. It's sick.



gamez fan
Reged: 02/23/13
Posts: 206
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: Stiletto]
#388760 - 11/23/20 10:06 AM


> There's legal organizations that will protect GPL projects' licenses more or less pro
> bono ("for free"), or didn't you know?
>
> That said, a lot of MAME's sourcecode is BSD licensed.
>
> - Stiletto

So there are people out there who work for free eh fancy that, most people i knew did not have that luxury what with having bills to pay etc etc, for them time was always money.

"or didn't you know"

Yes your living up to my expectations around MAMEDEV being typically middle class and it's a trait of your "ilk" to attempt to belittle and talk down to people you deem to be lower on the ladder of life who dare to have an opinion you just happen to disagree with.

I see it in all aspects of life the world of arcade preservation is no different, but to answer your question "i did not know that" as well i had no use for GPL lawyers on the building sites or in life generally so it's not a subject i read up on



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gamez fan
Reged: 02/23/13
Posts: 206
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: MooglyGuy]
#388761 - 11/23/20 10:53 AM


> > That decision at the end of the day is upto the "users" they'll make an informed
> > choice
> > around which builds they want to use on their own devices.
>
> It's been clear where you stand after years of your posts, but I should be equally
> clear: By and large, users don't make anything even remotely resembling an "informed
> choice".
>
> In actual fact, users go for what they perceive as the path of both least resistance
> and maximal ignorance. In most cases, that seems to be ancient versions of MAME
> bundled with ROMs that they find on this or that torrent site, or whatever combo is
> being peddled by the latest and not-so-greatest fly-by-night websites that post
> individual ROM sets up for download.
>
> These users neither know nor care about the overall aims of the MAME project
> throughout the years, nor about the development process, nor the rationale behind the
> decisions made. They care about one thing, being able to play old games for free.
>
> In fact, you can see it all over Reddit release threads and right here at home on
> MAMEWorld: If you actually try to inform users as to the overall lay of the land,
> what they stand to benefit by upgrading, and what they're missing out on by using a
> decades-old build, not only do they not care, they quite often react with outward
> hostility to the person trying to educate them: The person laboring to help them be
> truly capable of making the "informed decision" that you refer to.
>
> At the end of the day, it's not my business to judge what version of MAME a user
> happens to find most appropriate for their use case. But when those users become not
> just hostile, but openly abusive, towards the people who actually make things happen,
> the people who actually enable these users to relive their childhoods, for simply
> having the downright audacity to educate and inform them, then I will happily judge
> the lot.
>
> So many of you on here love to clutch at your pearls when MAMEdevs lash back after
> brooking years upon years of abuse for having the temerity to not do exactly what you
> want, it's nauseating. At times I feel like an abused wife, being expected to bow and
> scrape in obsequiousness, to cook and clean exactly to the husband's liking, while
> getting a slap or a black eye for the apparent injustice of serving him a steak
> that's two degrees too hot, or god forbid, two degrees too cold. It's sick.

Well actually it might not be clear where i stand as funny enough i do not disagree with
anything you said above, i just feel legal action to enforce a GPL licence in instances
where no one is seeking to profit from the work of MAME DEV might be not the best course
of action.

So that and another bee i have in my bonnet which i will not air on here are the only two
areas i might have a differing opinion from the dev team and general users on here per say.

Anyway take care of yourself and keep well.



Arcade Addict



MooglyGuy
Renegade MAME Dev
Reged: 09/01/05
Posts: 2075
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: gamez fan]
#388762 - 11/23/20 11:16 AM


> Yes your living up to my expectations around MAMEDEV being typically middle class and
> it's a trait of your "ilk" to attempt to belittle and talk down to people you deem to
> be lower on the ladder of life who dare to have an opinion you just happen to
> disagree with.

Sorry, I must have missed the post where you described to all of us how much you make a year, or what sort of job you work at. Or literally anything about you other than that you don't like that we don't do exactly what you want us to. Which, when it comes to upgrading MAME, puts us about even, doesn't it?

It's funny - not really, though - that you want to turn this into some kind of class discussion. The reality is that I don't know anything about you. I don't know anything about R. Coltrane, I don't know anything about TrevEB, I don't know anything about anyone on these forums other than what you yourselves put out there. And the same goes for the rest of us. You don't know anything about the life that I lead, that R. Belmont leads, that Olivier leads, that Stiletto leads, that Mr. Do leads, or that anyone leads, other than the assumptions that you've constructed in your own head in order to perpetuate what seems to be a sense of being aggrieved by society at large.

I spent a year unemployed in 2011. I was living off of what pittance I was able to scrape from UBI, a fraction of what I had gotten at my previous job. I had no savings. The only way I even kept a roof over my head was by having a friend who was kind enough to let my rent ride until I got back on my feet. There were days when after sending in my next round of job applications, I did literally nothing but wander around the household shared with 3 other people, rooting around in couches and looking in cabinet drawers to scrape together enough pocket change to walk up to the local supermarket and buy a block of ramen. There were days when I didn't even manage that, I had to rely on the hope that the next UBI payment would be X days away, or that maybe I could scrape together some more change and then be able to eat the next day.

To be perfectly blunt, there were times during that year that my friends were out of the house, and I stood on the staircase of the house my friends and I rented, a noose around my neck, a chair angled between my legs, just trying to gin up enough bitterness to kick the chair free, and ultimately free myself of the suffering I was going through.

You probably didn't know that, either. Now you do.

The reality is that everyone has hard points in their life. MAMEdev aren't some homogeneous construct, some paper cut-out of an idea that you've constructed in your head to rail against. The same goes for every other person you've met in your life, and probably written off as being part of the "middle class". You don't know their struggles, and they don't know yours, and as long as you're interested in perpetuating the idea that you're some set-upon victim, and engage in this sense of entitlement from people that most likely have about as much - perhaps even less - than you do, it's just going to keep going on and on.

The idea that you want to make such a reductive argument that this comes down to "class" isn't just abhorrent, it's flat-out morally wrong.

EDIT: Oh, and for the record, since this seems to be the thing that made you so upset? Yeah, I don't like the fact that Stiletto added the little "Or didn't you know?" snipe either. It's pointlessly fractious. You were engaging in what I thought was a reasonable discussion up to that point.



JonBoyRetro
MAME Fan
Reged: 09/25/11
Posts: 77
Loc: United Kingdom
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: Dullaron]
#388768 - 11/23/20 04:34 PM


I use an old version of MAME (106 ) not because I want to (I would like to use the latest version) but simply because that is the last version ported to AdvanceMame that I use on my Pi4, via Pi2Jamma and PinHP , connected to a Philips CM8833 monitor.

Apart from using a CRT (which I much prefer), the timings and resolutions are accurate to the original and there is something special about the 'glow' of a CRT.

I use a very small set of games - 37 vertical and 40 horizontal. These are my favourites and not restricted to those that simply work on 106. Luckily, these are older games so have more chance of working correctly on an older version of MAME.

BTW, I've never understood why people load an SD card with thousands of games but actually play just a handful. I have these same set of games on my PC with about 2 extra games as these are not supported by 106. No great loss in all honesty and I simply play these on my PC.

I have to say, I have never enjoyed my retro gaming more. No input lag, no motion blur and playing these games as they were meant to be played on a CRT. Lovely.

So, it's not because I wouldn't prefer a later version of MAME - but that the version I play is supported (easily) on CRT's.

Yes, they may be lacking in fixes but for the most part, they play just fine.

I'm not sure if it's possible but it would be great if perhaps MAME could, in the future, have some built-in support for CRT's natively.



God, I miss those dark, musty arcades ....



uman
MAME Fan
Reged: 04/14/12
Posts: 434
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: JonBoyRetro]
#388788 - 11/25/20 09:34 AM


@JonBoyRetro: there is a MAME derivate with native CRT support. It is called GroovyMAME. It keeps up with official MAME, so you could have a version that is always up to date. Problem is, it will not work with Rpi, as this platform is not beefy enough to keep up with current MAME. It exists for Windows and Linux and is meant to run on a PC.

However you could ask for help on their forum and i am pretty sure, you will find some answers to your specific problem, as nearly all people there love their CRTs (just like me). Always nice to see gamers that know that this is the best way to experience MAME.

Regarding the number of games: I am absolutely with you. It simply doesnt make sense to have billions of games in a Arcade-cab. I have around 500 games for my guests that want to play. Divided into categories it is a sane number to choose from. I can start a full blown MAME for myself, for adding or removing games and to keep the cab up to date.



uman
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: R.Coltrane]
#388791 - 11/25/20 10:23 AM


> > That decision at the end of the day is upto the "users" they'll make an informed
> > choice
> > around which builds they want to use on their own devices.
>
> Not exactly. It's not a "users" choice to use an old build. If they had a choice,
> they would certainly prefer the latest version. Old versions keep being ported
> because there's a pre-existing source code which is more portable to different
> devices/OS's.
>
> The most annoying aspect in this situation is that old romsets keep floating all
> around the web and they won't disappear because of such old builds, which require old
> romsets to work.

WRONG in all aspects. The reasons why there are so many old versions is that the target systems they are meant for, are to weak for a current up-to-date MAME. Original X-Box, Rpi, old PCs, Playstations, Nintendo Switches etc. etc.

This topic is useless to discuss anyway. It was discussed many times before and in many threads, with no satisfying results for any party. The majority here have no clue about CRTs and about systems that have native hardware support for CRTs. Even the MAMEdevs think that this scene is just a small group of users.

Please go with Ąlive and let liveď. No one wants to harm MAME or to disrespect MAMEdevs (Retroarch is a exception). Those people did their best to run MAME on that systems.

There is simply no other way to run actual MAME on that systems. If you know a better way for those target systems, then go for it. Otherwise simply stop this pointless discussion and stop putting fuel into it.



Dullaron
Diablo III - Dunard #1884
Reged: 07/22/05
Posts: 5892
Loc: Fort Worth, Tx
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: uman]
#388792 - 11/25/20 11:01 AM


> Regarding the number of games: I am absolutely with you. It simply doesnt make sense
> to have billions of games in a Arcade-cab. I have around 500 games for my
> guests that want to play. Divided into categories it is a sane number to choose from.
> I can start a full blown MAME for myself, for adding or removing games and to keep
> the cab up to date.

Yeah I agreed too. I don't play a ton of games. Only plays 1941, Centipede and many other good ones. Rest I don't mess with at all.



JonBoyRetro
MAME Fan
Reged: 09/25/11
Posts: 77
Loc: United Kingdom
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Re: Ported MAME 0.72 to the Nintendo Switch | MVG (Video) new [Re: uman]
#388802 - 11/26/20 02:19 PM


Thanks uman. Yes, I came across GroovyMame but there was the extra inconvenience of sourcing a graphics card with 15Khz output and having to knock up a suitable PC with drivers etc. In the end, RPI works fantastic. Even games such as Dangeron Feveron (one of the best shooters ever IMHO) plays at 60fps rock solid. The RPI takes up little space and is currently connected to my 360 controller. I do intend to build a cab around the RPI (compact, of course!) with a *proper* controller when I have time. But, for now, it's the nearest thing to being in an arcade running actual PCB's


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