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CPS2 emulation questions
#324626 - 04/13/14 12:40 PM
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I was into Vampire Savior and I read there are speed differences between the arcade cab and MAME, due to different frame rate. only solution for correct speed was to use mame-rr
also found this in dustloop which seems to be a CPS2 inherent issue.
these posts are over 3 years old. has the correct frame rate issue been addressed?
http://www.dustloop.com/forums/index.php...do-except-anak/
I've just tested using frame-by-frame controlled input in MAME in Vampire Savior, SFA2, SFA, and the original Darkstalkers, and reached the surprising conclusion that piano reversal inputs don't work in any CPS2 game from Darkstalkers onward (I didn't test any Marvel games, but I expect them to be similar, given that X-Men:COTA was released after Darkstalkers). In Darkstalkers and later games, when you press a button or buttons that complete a command input, it seems the engine always "consumes" the buffered joystick inputs whether you're in a state eligible to perform that move or not (by constrast, in SF2 the engine only "consumes" the buffered inputs if you actually perform the move)
However, I also tested SF3 3s and piano reversals do work in that game. This is not surprising, since we already know the SF3 engine has many differences from the CPS2 games in how inputs are processed--charge partitioning, toward-away-down-up as a valid alternate 360 input, etc.
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| AWJ |
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Reged: 03/08/05
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Re: CPS2 emulation questions
[Re: petran79]
#324627 - 04/13/14 01:25 PM
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> I've just tested using frame-by-frame controlled input in MAME in Vampire Savior,
> SFA2, SFA, and the original Darkstalkers, and reached the surprising conclusion that
> piano reversal inputs don't work in any CPS2 game from Darkstalkers onward (I didn't
> test any Marvel games, but I expect them to be similar, given that X-Men:COTA was
> released after Darkstalkers). In Darkstalkers and later games, when you press a
> button or buttons that complete a command input, it seems the engine always
> "consumes" the buffered joystick inputs whether you're in a state eligible to perform
> that move or not (by constrast, in SF2 the engine only "consumes" the buffered inputs
> if you actually perform the move)
>
> However, I also tested SF3 3s and piano reversals do work in that game. This is not
> surprising, since we already know the SF3 engine has many differences from the CPS2
> games in how inputs are processed--charge partitioning, toward-away-down-up as a
> valid alternate 360 input, etc.
Wow, that's my post from 4 years ago...
I think you're misinterpreting the post. What that post is describing is not something specific to MAME, it's a difference between game engines. "piano reversal" is a technique to execute reversal attacks more easily/reliably by pressing more than one button to do the attack. This technique is possible in Street Fighter 2 (all versions) and in Street Fighter 3, but is not possible in the Street Fighter Alpha games or the Darkstalkers/Vampire games, because of differences in the way the respective game engines process inputs.
Once again, this is not a MAME thing, this is a difference between the actual games. You cannot piano reversal in the SFAlpha or Vampire games on real hardware. It's not related to hardware differences either (SSF2 and SSF2T are on CPS2 hardware and you can piano reversal in them), it's a difference in the game software.
Can you provide a source for the claim that there's a frame rate difference between mame-rr and baseline MAME?
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Re: CPS2 emulation questions
[Re: AWJ]
#324636 - 04/13/14 07:29 PM
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discussion was about two years ago
found it. jedpossum clarified on FBA discussion that this was more of a refresh rate issue
That is wrong, the refresh rate is 59 not the frames generated per second. And if you add turbo there will be even less frames.
original quote is here:
http://www.dustloop.com/forums/index.php?/topic/110-vs-general-discussion/page-15#entry509992
Without really seeing what's going on, I can offer two pieces of general advice:
1. If you are practicing this game anywhere else but on an emulator, know that Vampire Savior is meant to run at 59 Frames Per Second while GGPO (and probably all other emus) run it at 60 FPS. I've heard that for some people this can make a huge difference in their timing. Even in my case, without having known that for the longest time, I noticed that sometimes, certain maneuvers simply felt easier when I wasn't on GGPO. So, if you're practicing somewhere else, you might just wanna practice on an emulator.
I remember also reading that Callus still has the correct speed on CPS1 Street Fighter. Cant find that unfortunately
discussion on shoryuken:
http://forums.shoryuken.com/discussion/comment/7036085
FBA speed vs what it should be:
some people thought mame was slower than fba. a somewhat sketchy test where you pause the game and use a frame advance in the input test option of the service menu suggested that it also had the most input lag, and that elsemi's CPS3 emulator had the least. i always thought the gameplay felt closest to the arcade in elsemi's emulator, but further testing of it is probably not helpful if nobody uses it.
Yeah that's been my perception of MAME as well. I know some of the ST guys were saying that it has improved on cps2 and that it's the closest you'll find to arcade perfect. Curious if MAME has made similar strides for cps3. I downloaded the most recent version and went through arcade mode, but it's tough to tell just based on feel how the input lag is. It definitely felt different from fba to me.
Does anyone have an idea of how MAME performs versus any of the other versions? Does the speed feel closer to the real hardware or no?
Depends which version of MAME. Re-Record version of MAME allows you to adjust the cpu speed.
CPS2 games should be on 75%
Yeah I've noticed that. If you change the CPU speed setting in ST from 75%, the game speeds up. Doesn't seem to be the case in other CPS2 games, like the Alpha series, though
Edited by petran79 (04/13/14 07:32 PM)
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