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mike20599
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#GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm?
#332749 - 10/04/14 07:09 AM


Or are retro games people not concerned?



Sune
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*yawn* is what I think. Also, get off my lawn new [Re: mike20599]
#332750 - 10/04/14 07:44 AM


I tried but I couldn't even make it halfway through the wiki. Gamergate sounds like a bunch of politically correct "offended" whining people. Shut up and go make some awesome games that do whatever it is that you believe that games should do. At least write up a concept or a storyboard. Until then, shut up and let me enjoy my misogynistic, sexist, violent and morally reprehensible entertainment.

S



mike20599
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The short version new [Re: Sune]
#332753 - 10/04/14 09:30 AM


This whole thing started because some female game dev whore fucked a bunch of video game journalists so they would write positive reviews of her game.

GamerGate people are calling for journalistic integrity.

Anti-GamerGate people cry out misogyny because she happens to be a woman.

A lot of people who enjoy sexy womenz in their video games have latched on to the pro-GamerGate side. And the feminazis of course sided with anti-GamerGate.

The GamerGate people just recently managed to convince Intel to pull their ads from a big games website where the anti-GamerGates write boohoo articles about sexism in games and call people who enjoy them man-children and such.
http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/03/tech/gaming-gadgets/intel-ad-gamasutra/index.html?hpt=hp_bn5



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Re: #GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm? new [Re: mike20599]
#332754 - 10/04/14 09:37 AM


Joe Quinn is the worst kind of person, but that doesn't mean she deserves death/rape threats. However I have trouble feeling sorry for her, since she's previously used t3h internet hate machine to her advantage, and turnabout's fair play. On top of that, some of the threats/attacks she's complaining about look staged (e.g. when she was supposedly dox'ed but they didn't use her real name). As for the way the North American gaming media and indy games development scene seems to be a massive narcissistic, nepotistic circlejerk, who's really surprised? I think everyone could see that already.



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Huh?... Wha?..... [nt] new [Re: mike20599]
#332760 - 10/04/14 03:00 PM


> Or are retro games people not concerned?

Not me, personally.



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Re: #GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm? new [Re: mike20599]
#332761 - 10/04/14 03:41 PM


> Or are retro games people not concerned?

I think largely we are people who are interested in the technology behind the games, and/or fans of games in general, not "retro" games specifically. The older games had less to work with, so often display more talent and clarity in their design and execution. But as to "concern:"


Games are art. An art, but as well art. Art in the construction, art in the design, art in the final product, and art even in the playing, to some extent.

The supreme purpose of art is to hold a mirror to the world. It reflects its subject, but also the time and place of its creation.

You do not change the world by "fixing" the things art depicts; you can only do, if anything, the inverse: to change what art reveals about the world, you must change the world.

Certainly, you can produce art that tries to change the world, but it best does that by exposing the thing you seek to change, not by hiding it, whitewashing it, pretending it doesn't exist. You need to proclaim as loudly as you can within your art that some ugliness exists, shove it in the face of those who would view it, and be sure to make clear that it is wrong.

The videos and blogs attacking games, gaming, and gamers are therefor wrong, useless, and perhaps counterproductive. And the one video I saw was even factually inaccurate, mixing the simple depiction of modern depravity in distasteful forms with scenes that target those actions as being wrong and evil.

Directing unwarranted violence toward a person is bad. So is directing unwarranted hatred toward a large --and growing-- segment of the population. More people are born into this world in which computerized recreation is normal every day, and you don't "grow out of" your enjoyment of such. Within whatever might be considered the developed world, in another generation only those who shun computers entirely outside of the workplace will not be "gamers." By all indications, the things she attacked will still exist, so will still be part of their experience.



mike20599
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Here's a more balanced summary of events new [Re: mike20599]
#332781 - 10/05/14 04:53 AM


http://techcrunch.com/2014/09/25/gamergate-an-issue-with-2-sides/



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Re: #GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm? new [Re: TriggerFin]
#332782 - 10/05/14 05:04 AM Attachment: 140218 T2.JPG 47 KB (1 downloads)


Auhmmm.... That's true often in Culture, but in Art, no. Art is the [craft] of depicting one's mental imagery, for Art's sake. It often, and has often, used imagery from the world. Ideally, there is little to no message, just imagery or whatever content.

Of course, I'm again speaking from a sensibility of [Art] Music, as music is [about] the most abstract art. And in that vein, I tend to defer to such things. Here's some of my own. (I can, though, take only a little credit. I selected the music and WMP visualization that produced this.)




> Games are art. An art, but as well art. Art in the construction, art in the design,
> art in the final product, and art even in the playing, to some extent.
>
> The supreme purpose of art is to hold a mirror to the world. It reflects its subject,
> but also the time and place of its creation.
>
> You do not change the world by "fixing" the things art depicts; you can only do, if
> anything, the inverse: to change what art reveals about the world, you must change
> the world.
>
> Certainly, you can produce art that tries to change the world, but it best does that
> by exposing the thing you seek to change, not by hiding it, whitewashing it,
> pretending it doesn't exist. You need to proclaim as loudly as you can within your
> art that some ugliness exists, shove it in the face of those who would view it, and
> be sure to make clear that it is wrong.
>
> The videos and blogs attacking games, gaming, and gamers are therefor wrong, useless,
> and perhaps counterproductive. And the one video I saw was even factually inaccurate,
> mixing the simple depiction of modern depravity in distasteful forms with scenes that
> target those actions as being wrong and evil.
>
> Directing unwarranted violence toward a person is bad. So is directing unwarranted
> hatred toward a large --and growing-- segment of the population. More people are born
> into this world in which computerized recreation is normal every day, and you don't
> "grow out of" your enjoyment of such. Within whatever might be considered the
> developed world, in another generation only those who shun computers entirely outside
> of the workplace will not be "gamers." By all indications, the things she attacked
> will still exist, so will still be part of their experience.

[ATTACHED IMAGE - CLICK FOR FULL SIZE]

Attachment



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Sune
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Re: #GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm? new [Re: Traso]
#332783 - 10/05/14 05:11 AM


> Auhmmm.... That's true often in Culture, but in Art, no. Art is the [craft] of
> depicting one's mental imagery, for Art's sake. It often, and has often, used imagery
> from the world. Ideally, there is little to no message, just imagery or whatever
> content.
>
> Of course, I'm again speaking from a sensibility of [Art] Music, as music is [about]
> the most abstract art. And in that vein, I tend to defer to such things. Here's some
> of my own. (I can, though, take only a little credit. I selected the music and WMP
> visualization that produced this.)

You are so full of shit. Go back to your porch.

S



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Re: #GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm? new [Re: Traso]
#332785 - 10/05/14 05:52 AM


> Auhmmm.... That's true often in Culture, but in Art, no. Art is the [craft] of
> depicting one's mental imagery, for Art's sake. It often, and has often, used imagery
> from the world. Ideally, there is little to no message, just imagery or whatever
> content.
>
> Of course, I'm again speaking from a sensibility of [Art] Music, as music is [about]
> the most abstract art. And in that vein, I tend to defer to such things. Here's some
> of my own. (I can, though, take only a little credit. I selected the music and WMP
> visualization that produced this.)

Music without message is crap. It may be buried and hard to detect, but if the world did not create it, it should go die in a... no, "die in a fire" evokes the burning of art, and it wouldn't be worthy of that if it lacked meaning. So, it should just go away, forgotten.



Tomu Breidah
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Re: #GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm? new [Re: TriggerFin]
#332786 - 10/05/14 07:06 AM


> Music without message is crap.


Well, there's a lot of music that doesn't really have a 'message' that a lot of people wouldn't consider "crap". I mean, that's a matter of opinion anyway. Personally, I think any (so-called) music that promotes killing, violence, promiscuity, etc. (I'm sure you know what I'm thinking about) is 'cRap'. Maybe it's better to say; "Music without a good message is crap." But, again, that's a matter of opinion. Some might like music with a bad message.

I finally listened to '99 problems' by JayZ, today. I focused on the melody (what should be considered if qualifying as 'music'). What little there was - it was simply repetitive. But that's not the main focus on that type of, so-called, 'music'. It's the lyrics, and that bears the brunt of the 'message'.

But enough about that. Music with no 'message' could be considered good... Nice to listen to. Classical guitar music, without lyrics?.... Soothes the soul! A couple years back I listened to a lot of psytrance. I guess it could be considered a branch of Techno/Electronic music. Nowadays, if I listen to anything, it's more of the AmbientPsy variety.

So, I can't really think of how those types of music have a literal 'message' -per'se. It's just how they make you feel. Then again, I might be taking the term 'message' too literally.



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Re: #GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm? new [Re: TriggerFin]
#332787 - 10/05/14 07:06 AM


> Music without message is crap. It may be buried and hard to detect, but if the world
> did not create it, it should go die in a... no, "die in a fire" evokes the burning of
> art, and it wouldn't be worthy of that if it lacked meaning. So, it should just go
> away, forgotten.

I'm sorry you feel that way, this means there's a lot of music that you will never be able to enjoy.

Music purely for musics sake is A Thing™. It doesn't necessarily have a message as such but can be beautifully crafted and executed and put you in a certain mood if you let it.

Some music is like a house that is beautifully built with great materials, by someone who loves what they do. Maybe you wouldn't like to live in it but that doesn't mean you can't see that it's quality work and enjoy looking at it.

S



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Re: #GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm? new [Re: Sune]
#332793 - 10/05/14 10:56 AM


> > Music without message is crap. It may be buried and hard to detect, but if the
> world
> > did not create it, it should go die in a... no, "die in a fire" evokes the burning
> of
> > art, and it wouldn't be worthy of that if it lacked meaning. So, it should just go
> > away, forgotten.
>
> I'm sorry you feel that way, this means there's a lot of music that you will never be
> able to enjoy.
>
> Music purely for musics sake is A Thing™. It doesn't necessarily have a message as
> such but can be beautifully crafted and executed and put you in a certain mood if you
> let it.
>
> Some music is like a house that is beautifully built with great materials, by someone
> who loves what they do. Maybe you wouldn't like to live in it but that doesn't mean
> you can't see that it's quality work and enjoy looking at it.
>
> S

It was created for a reason and to express something; there is purpose behind the creation. I don't mean necessarily a message conveyed by lyrics. If the force that drove the artist is conveyable to an audience, the message is there.

There was some... disgust that entered the post, that one could think that art is meaningless. I was coming back to address that. If there is nothing driving the artist to produce it, it is without purpose, and therefor without value.



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Re: #GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm? new [Re: Tomu Breidah]
#332795 - 10/05/14 12:27 PM


> Nowadays, if I listen to anything, it's more of the
> AmbientPsy variety.
>
Like... the pure moods disk?

I'm not very picky about music myself. Sometimes gangster rap gets on my nerves and I can't stand the death metal crap where they are just screaming into the mic the whole time... other than tat, anything is game.



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Re: #GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm? new [Re: Vas Crabb]
#332800 - 10/05/14 03:42 PM


> Joe Quinn is the worst kind of person, but that doesn't mean she deserves death/rape
> threats. However I have trouble feeling sorry for her, since she's previously used
> t3h internet hate machine to her advantage, and turnabout's fair play. On top of
> that, some of the threats/attacks she's complaining about look staged (e.g. when she
> was supposedly dox'ed but they didn't use her real name). As for the way the North
> American gaming media and indy games development scene seems to be a massive
> narcissistic, nepotistic circlejerk, who's really surprised? I think everyone could
> see that already.

Agreed all around. Did anyone *not* come out of "Indie Games: The Movie" wanting to punch nearly everyone who appeared on-screen in it? I love me some Super Meat Boy, but damn.



Tomu Breidah
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Re: #GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm? new [Re: URherenow]
#332801 - 10/05/14 03:58 PM


> > Nowadays, if I listen to anything, it's more of the
> > AmbientPsy variety.
> >
> Like... the pure moods disk?
>


Not what I was thinking. It's okay, I guess. I'll provide some example at the end of this post.


> I'm not very picky about music myself. Sometimes gangster rap gets on my nerves and I
> can't stand the death metal crap where they are just screaming into the mic the whole
> time... other than tat, anything is game.

I agree with those sentiments.


A couple example of the AmbientPsy, or whatever they'd be classified as...

http://youtu.be/g-NSUXirTkw

http://youtu.be/LzhUVz56Fk0

You don't have to listen to all of them. The links are just to give you an idea.

*had to get on my old computer where I had the songs/vids saved to...*

As for the Psytrance songs; here's more or less a playlist...

Mad Maxx vs Poli - They Say This Is Cool
Krunch - Food (Mind Complex Remix)
Ritmo - Disharmonic Silence (Flegma & Nerso Rmx)
Dualsung - 400,000 Stars (Suntree Rmx)
Suntree - Back To The Source
Aquatica - Crystal Dancefloor
Cosmosis - Journey Of The Soul
Cosmosis - The Other Side
Cosmosis - Doors of Perception
Cosmosis - Dance of the Cosmic Serpent
Man With No Name - Azymuth
Man With No Name - Space Juice
Man With No Name - Axis Flip
Electric Universe - One Step Beyond
Asura - life^2
Headroom - Will Never End (one of my favorites)

Edited by Tomu Breidah (10/05/14 04:20 PM)



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Re: #GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm? new [Re: Tomu Breidah]
#332820 - 10/05/14 11:25 PM


> Classical guitar music, without lyrics?.... Soothes the soul!

That kinda music will just do that.



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Re: #GamerGate - What do you guys think about this shitstorm? new [Re: Vas Crabb]
#332858 - 10/06/14 04:17 PM


> Joe Quinn is the worst kind of person, but that doesn't mean she deserves death/rape
> threats.

Funny, neither did the ten-year-old that her adoring fans doxxed and threatened to stab because he said something that they happened to disagree with. Nothing but jackasses on either side of this debate, I'm afraid.



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That's funny new [Re: mike20599]
#332886 - 10/07/14 12:16 PM


A coworker just quoted this one chick's blog to me, apparently she leads off with "Let's call a spade a spade: Hardcore has always meant 'dick'."

Putting aside the fact that that is incorrect, I told my coworker he should leave a comment on her blog calling her a racist, as "spade" has been used in the past as a slur against black people. While the phrase "Let's call a spade a spade" pre-dates the word's use as an ethnic slur, these naïve little Social Justice Warriors would have us avoid using any words that could possibly offend someone's pwecious wittle feewings, so it's just funny to me that this woman would have such a spectacular lack of social awareness that she'd use such a phrase when leading off her PMSing rant about how evil men are.



mike20599
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Reddit link if you'd like to be more involved new [Re: MooglyGuy]
#332898 - 10/07/14 06:24 PM


http://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/



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Re: Reddit link if you'd like to be more involved new [Re: mike20599]
#332903 - 10/07/14 07:48 PM


> http://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/

Yeah, I think Moogly will want to stay out given the MS thing.



mike20599
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The mainstream media is picking up this story... new [Re: mike20599]
#333352 - 10/17/14 11:29 AM


...and it's not pretty. Evil, unwashed, neck-beard, virgin video gamers harass poor, innocent women. It fits all their preconceived notions. It has a scary boogieman. It has a helpless victim. No wonder they didn't bother to fact check anything. The truth will come out if we fight for it though.



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Re: The mainstream media is picking up this story... new [Re: mike20599]
#333415 - 10/18/14 03:01 AM


> ...and it's not pretty. Evil, unwashed, neck-beard, virgin video gamers harass poor,
> innocent women. It fits all their preconceived notions. It has a scary boogieman. It
> has a helpless victim. No wonder they didn't bother to fact check anything. The truth
> will come out if we fight for it though.


There is no truth. There is only one herd's feelings about things, versus another's. It's easier to let them swirl...but that's a very Mind-like thing to do.



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