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SSD N00b...
#347312 - 11/23/15 07:37 AM
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Welp, just bought my first SSD - Transcend 512GB. The question I have is, is it possible to transfer the system over to the new drive, but delete just the OS from the other drive and keep using it? I currently have a 2TB HDD and I want to keep using it, but boot off the SSD. Or will I have to copy everything over to another drive (have a 3TB backup drive currently awaiting Win 10 to be installed in order to be able to use it- Win 7 backup won't work with a 3TB drive), reformat the internal 2TB drive, then copy everything back? Or is it possible to do the Win 10 upgrade and just have Windows install it on the SSD instead of overwriting Win 7 on the HDD?
I see all sorts of stuff on cloning the drive then removing the original, but as I said I want to keep using the HDD, just not as the boot device. Bah, what a headache...
Edit: BTW, AHCI is already enabled, and the OS sees the drive but it is not formatted or mounted yet.
Edited by Qun Mang (11/23/15 07:53 AM)
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Re: SSD N00b...
[Re: Qun Mang]
#347322 - 11/23/15 12:56 PM
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You can clone the old drive to the SSD and once you have it booting with the SSD, you can wipe the old drive. You'll probably need to choose the boot drive in the BIOS to get it booting off the SSD. Or if you have a usb to sata adapter, you can remove the old drive, boot off the SSD, then connect the old drive via USB and wipe it before reinstalling it.
I've had good luck with the free version of Macrium Reflect for doing the cloning on two different laptops so far (new SSD drives)...
http://www.macrium.com/reflectfree.aspx
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| redk9258 |
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Re: SSD N00b...
[Re: Qun Mang]
#347323 - 11/23/15 01:04 PM
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If you clone it, be sure to boot from the SSD at least once without the HDD connected. Otherwise you may end up using the boot files on the old drive. The problem is that Windows uses the disk signature (or I guess volume signature) to find the boot files. If you clone the drive, both drives end up with the same signature. That's why you are better off booting with the original drive unplugged. Then at least change the signature of the old drive.
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Re: SSD N00b...
[Re: krick]
#347328 - 11/23/15 05:11 PM
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> You can clone the old drive to the SSD and once you have it booting with the SSD, you
> can wipe the old drive. You'll probably need to choose the boot drive in the BIOS to
> get it booting off the SSD. Or if you have a usb to sata adapter, you can remove the
> old drive, boot off the SSD, then connect the old drive via USB and wipe it before
> reinstalling it.
>
> I've had good luck with the free version of Macrium Reflect for doing the cloning on
> two different laptops so far (new SSD drives)...
> http://www.macrium.com/reflectfree.aspx
Thanks, I will look into that program. I know Transcend offers their own program too, but good to hear of positive experience with another. I don't have a USB to SATA adapter, at least for a 3.5" drive (I have two former laptop 2.5" drives in shells though, but they may not be designed to allow a 3.5" drive to at least plug in- I'll see).
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Re: SSD N00b...
[Re: redk9258]
#347331 - 11/23/15 05:31 PM
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> If you clone it, be sure to boot from the SSD at least once without the HDD
> connected. Otherwise you may end up using the boot files on the old drive. The
> problem is that Windows uses the disk signature (or I guess volume signature) to find
> the boot files. If you clone the drive, both drives end up with the same signature.
> That's why you are better off booting with the original drive unplugged. Then at
> least change the signature of the old drive.
That definitely sound like what I'll need to do, though I will need to look up what you're talking about with changing the signature. Krick suggested plugging the 2TB drive afterward via a USB adapter so will look into that as well. That said, I am guessing that in order to clone a larger drive, I'm going to need to move off the extra data anyway so there is under 512GB to clone. If I have to do that anyway, I suppose it wouldn't be much more to just format it after the clone successfully boots.
Still, it would be nice to just have the Windows 10 upgrade actually install as a dual-boot to the new drive leaving Windows 7 alone for the time being, but I suppose the free upgrade doesn't work that way.
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Re: SSD N00b...
[Re: krick]
#347333 - 11/23/15 06:34 PM
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> You can clone the old drive to the SSD and once you have it booting with the SSD, you
> can wipe the old drive. You'll probably need to choose the boot drive in the BIOS to
> get it booting off the SSD. Or if you have a usb to sata adapter, you can remove the
> old drive, boot off the SSD, then connect the old drive via USB and wipe it before
> reinstalling it.
>
> I've had good luck with the free version of Macrium Reflect for doing the cloning on
> two different laptops so far (new SSD drives)...
> http://www.macrium.com/reflectfree.aspx
Another vote here for Reflect, which is also a fabulous backup solution - you can mount an image as a network drive and just view/copy whatever individual files you might need very easily. -JW
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/EDIT sorry, I had too much coffee
[Re: Qun Mang]
#347336 - 11/23/15 07:13 PM
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> Welp, just bought my first SSD - Transcend 512GB. The question I have is, is it
> possible to transfer the system over to the new drive, but delete just the OS from
> the other drive and keep using it?
Yes of course, as long as...
> I currently have a 2TB HDD and I want to keep using it, but boot off the SSD.
You won't be able to clone the 2TB drive to the SSD at all if the data exceeds 512GB.
Cloning software does not and cannot distinguish between what data belongs to your OS install and what data is your personal stuff.
/EDIT ok, sorry, I read the topic a bit more attentively, you're not that N00b.
Anyway what you're asking is pretty much the whole point of cloning software. Otherwise we'd be dragging and dropping folders onto the new drive and that would be it.
S
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Re: /EDIT sorry, I had too much coffee
[Re: Sune]
#347340 - 11/24/15 01:00 AM
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> > Welp, just bought my first SSD - Transcend 512GB. The question I have is, is it
> > possible to transfer the system over to the new drive, but delete just the OS from
> > the other drive and keep using it?
>
> Yes of course, as long as...
>
> > I currently have a 2TB HDD and I want to keep using it, but boot off the SSD.
>
> You won't be able to clone the 2TB drive to the SSD at all if the data exceeds 512GB.
> Cloning software does not and cannot distinguish between what data belongs to your OS
> install and what data is your personal stuff.
>
> /EDIT ok, sorry, I read the topic a bit more attentively, you're not that N00b.
>
> Anyway what you're asking is pretty much the whole point of cloning software.
> Otherwise we'd be dragging and dropping folders onto the new drive and that would be
> it.
>
> S
Just dragging and dropping the OS to the new drive would be nice. Windows, Users, both Program Files folders, and the hidden files and folders on C:. Make new drive bootable, remove boot capability from HDD. Delete said OS files and folders from HDD when SDD boots. Done. I'm just lazy I guess, looking for the quick and easy option. I'm also a little paranoid about something causing me to have to reinstall Windows completely so I want something safe. I have read some horror stories about installing SSD drives. But as long as the original drive is untouched after cloning until I decide to format it, I guess it is safe.
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Re: /EDIT sorry, I had too much coffee
[Re: Qun Mang]
#347344 - 11/24/15 05:11 AM
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> I'm also a little paranoid about something causing me to have to reinstall Windows
> completely so I want something safe. I have read some horror stories about installing
> SSD drives. But as long as the original drive is untouched after cloning until I
> decide to format it, I guess it is safe.
Sure, keep it around for a while until you're sure that the clone boots and works.
I used Macrium Reflect, which was recommended here, both on my laptop and my desktop, when got a new SSD last month. That was after trying Samsung's own "Data Migration" software, which refused to work - and I was cloning one Samsung SSD to another!
The SSD that went in the laptop was my old desktop SSD..so, no backup. It was a dumb thing to do but thankfully everything is working fine.
S
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Re: /EDIT sorry, I had too much coffee
[Re: Sune]
#347355 - 11/24/15 07:53 AM
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>
> Sure, keep it around for a while until you're sure that the clone boots and works.
>
> I used Macrium Reflect, which was recommended here, both on my laptop and my desktop,
> when got a new SSD last month. That was after trying Samsung's own "Data Migration"
> software, which refused to work - and I was cloning one Samsung SSD to another!
>
> The SSD that went in the laptop was my old desktop SSD..so, no backup. It was a dumb
> thing to do but thankfully everything is working fine.
>
> S
You two have me convinced. I have downloaded and installed the free edition and will give it a go during my free time later this week. I'll keep you posted.
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If you partitioned your drive........
[Re: Qun Mang]
#347358 - 11/24/15 08:46 AM
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You should be able to back it up, or clone it, to the new drive; Win 10 the new one; then delete the OS partition on the old when you're ready.
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Re: SSD N00b...
[Re: JWJr]
#347359 - 11/24/15 08:48 AM
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> Another vote here for Reflect, which is also a fabulous backup solution - you can mount an image as a network drive and just view/copy whatever individual files you might need very easily. -JW
It seems like a coolio thing....but as I partition my drives, I'm trying to think of how this would be useful to me.
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Re: If you partitioned your drive........
[Re: Traso]
#347369 - 11/24/15 11:15 PM
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> You should be able to back it up, or clone it, to the new drive; Win 10 the new one;
> then delete the OS partition on the old when you're ready.
What are you saying. How would partitioning the drive help?
S
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Re: If you partitioned your drive........
[Re: Sune]
#347370 - 11/25/15 12:53 AM
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> > You should be able to back it up, or clone it, to the new drive; Win 10 the new
> one;
> > then delete the OS partition on the old when you're ready.
>
> What are you saying. How would partitioning the drive help?
>
> S
I've actually partitioned my drives in the past, but when I did I had to guess how much space I thought the OS was going to take and I usually cut it short. This time when I got the computer I just left things alone with the one 2TB partition. Of course, had I partitioned the drive I wouldn't have to worry now about offloading the extra data onto an external drive before cloning. That's what it looks like he's saying.
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Re: If you partitioned your drive........
[Re: Qun Mang]
#347471 - 11/27/15 01:31 AM
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> Of course, had I partitioned the drive I wouldn't have to worry now about offloading the
> extra data onto an external drive before cloning. That's what it looks like he's
> saying.
OK but then he should have said "If you had..."
To me it looks like he's telling you to partition the drive now, which does not make any sense at all since you obviously have more than 512GB of data on the 2TB drive. Partitioning software does not know where your Windows Folder ends and your My Documents folder begins.
Some partitioning software (such as OS X's built-in Disk Utility) depending on the filesystem of the drive, lets you split off empty space into a new partition. But this functionality is not useful in your case - unless you are prepared to start deleting or moving away stuff until you're down to less than 512GB.
/EDIT actually I think it's possible to clone without partitioning the drive first, with some cloning software. What I mean to say is, if the partition to be cloned is larger than the space available on the target drive, but the actual contents of it are not, then you can still clone it.
S
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Re: If you partitioned your drive........
[Re: Sune]
#347477 - 11/27/15 03:34 AM
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> OK but then he should have said "If you had..."
>
> To me it looks like he's telling you to partition the drive now, which does not make
> any sense at all since you obviously have more than 512GB of data on the 2TB drive.
> Partitioning software does not know where your Windows Folder ends and your My
> Documents folder begins.
>
> Some partitioning software (such as OS X's built-in Disk Utility) depending on the
> filesystem of the drive, lets you split off empty space into a new partition. But
> this functionality is not useful in your case - unless you are prepared to start
> deleting or moving away stuff until you're down to less than 512GB.
>
> /EDIT actually I think it's possible to clone without partitioning the drive first,
> with some cloning software. What I mean to say is, if the partition to be cloned is
> larger than the space available on the target drive, but the actual contents of it
> are not, then you can still clone it.
>
> S
I've been busy offloading since last night. I think I'm doing the final folder right now. over 6.5 hours into a 260GB folder- on file ~358,000 of 466,000 as I write this.
Next steps- pull the Windows 7 license key and save it just in case- OEM machine from Micro Center that didn't give me the key on paper (at least I don't recall seeing it). There is a util to do this I know. Then I will probably delete all my Steam games since I can just re-download them. Also make a backup of the remaining folders before trying this clone software. It looks like I will have to wait until Sunday to continue as I am busy all day tomorrow and Friday.
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Re: If you partitioned your drive........
[Re: Qun Mang]
#347482 - 11/27/15 05:09 AM
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> Then I will probably delete all my Steam
> games since I can just re-download them.
You can have Steam do a local backup of your games, then reinstall the games from the backup once you're done cloning, it's a lot faster.
S
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Re: If you partitioned your drive........
[Re: Sune]
#347491 - 11/27/15 09:03 AM
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> > Then I will probably delete all my Steam
> > games since I can just re-download them.
>
> You can have Steam do a local backup of your games, then reinstall the games from the
> backup once you're done cloning, it's a lot faster.
>
> S
+1 on backing up Steam files rather than deleting, with the caveat that the size of your Steam library (and your available b/w) will have some bearing on the decision. My current library is 617GB, which took about 3 hours to backup from spinning disk to spinning disk via gigabit ethernet last time I needed to do it; the same download would have been 2-3 days at my connection speeds.
Here is a link to a link (to a link) of a thread here from when I did a large HDD to smaller SSD migration a few years back... This method used Windows Backup and built-in disk tools, with no need for 3rd party software: Clicky
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Re: If you partitioned your drive........
[Re: jeremymtc]
#347534 - 11/28/15 01:37 AM
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> > > Then I will probably delete all my Steam
> > > games since I can just re-download them.
> >
> > You can have Steam do a local backup of your games, then reinstall the games from
> the
> > backup once you're done cloning, it's a lot faster.
> >
> > S
>
>
> +1 on backing up Steam files rather than deleting, with the caveat that the size of
> your Steam library (and your available b/w) will have some bearing on the decision.
> My current library is 617GB, which took about 3 hours to backup from spinning disk to
> spinning disk via gigabit ethernet last time I needed to do it; the same download
> would have been 2-3 days at my connection speeds.
>
> Here is a link to a link (to a link) of a thread here from when I did a large HDD to
> smaller SSD migration a few years back... This method used Windows Backup and
> built-in disk tools, with no need for 3rd party software: Clicky
I'll take a look at it. I just checked and my Steam folder is only 193GB. I might just let it be part of the clone for now- I don't think my OS/applications/user folder is over (or even near) 300MB. I could be wrong though. Eventually of course I will move my Steam folder back to the hard drive.
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Finally finished moving system
[Re: Qun Mang]
#347843 - 12/07/15 04:45 AM
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Boot time went from over 60s to 23s according to Wise Care (though I saw the desktop much sooner). I didn't even have to remove the old drive- I just rebooted, hit F8 to change the boot device, and here I am. I will remove it for the next step just to make sure, but since i made it this far that shouldn't be a problem. Then, format and spend hours copy back all the files that took hours and hours to move to the external drive in the first place.
Edit: 19s without the hard drive attached.
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Re: Finally finished moving system
[Re: Qun Mang]
#347852 - 12/07/15 06:17 PM
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> Boot time went from over 60s to 23s according to Wise Care (though I saw the desktop
> much sooner). I didn't even have to remove the old drive- I just rebooted, hit F8 to
> change the boot device, and here I am. I will remove it for the next step just to
> make sure, but since i made it this far that shouldn't be a problem. Then, format and
> spend hours copy back all the files that took hours and hours to move to the external
> drive in the first place.
>
> Edit: 19s without the hard drive attached.
Those are the 4 seconds your BIOS spends detecting and enumerating the extra drive. This will increase as you add drives. Some BIOSes might have a way to minimize this time, maybe by telling it which drives are bootable and which drives aren't. I have 4 drives, two of which are bootable, but I haven't tried to tweak this on mine.
I'd keep the drive installed and use it for music, movies and other stuff that don't need to load fast or that don't benefit (a lot) from faster loading times.
My OS is on a 120GB SSD, with +50GB still free. I store almost everything on a second, mechanical drive, even my email, Steam and some apps that I think load fast enough, or that I rarely use. I keep another mechanical drive just for multitrack recording.
S
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Re: Finally finished moving system
[Re: Sune]
#347868 - 12/08/15 03:52 AM
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>
> Those are the 4 seconds your BIOS spends detecting and enumerating the extra drive.
> This will increase as you add drives. Some BIOSes might have a way to minimize this
> time, maybe by telling it which drives are bootable and which drives aren't. I have 4
> drives, two of which are bootable, but I haven't tried to tweak this on mine.
>
> I'd keep the drive installed and use it for music, movies and other stuff that don't
> need to load fast or that don't benefit (a lot) from faster loading times.
>
> My OS is on a 120GB SSD, with +50GB still free. I store almost everything on a
> second, mechanical drive, even my email, Steam and some apps that I think load fast
> enough, or that I rarely use. I keep another mechanical drive just for multitrack
> recording.
>
> S
Oh, I intend to keep the 2TB installed. Games, videos, and more require the space and I would rather not offload it all to an external drive. Besides, I need that space back for backups. Now that I have finished (well, the file moving is still going on- the current folder has been at it for almost a day and isn't even halfway done- over 700,000 files) I will be ghosting the new drive then upgrading to Win 10. I also have to fix all the game and emulation start menu shortcuts to point to the new drive letter.
By the way, Reflect did an outstanding job- it even copied over the recovery partition which I wasn't aware at first that I had until I looked at the drive in disk management. I now add my own experience to the recommendations given here.
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Re: Finally finished moving system
[Re: Qun Mang]
#347877 - 12/08/15 04:45 AM
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You can rename the drives, which takes a hell of a lot less time than re-doing your links. That's another reason I partition my drives, so that the back-up/ghosting is exactly the same...although I think you can dictate this at run-time, either way.....
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Re: Finally finished moving system
[Re: Qun Mang]
#347882 - 12/08/15 05:04 AM
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> Edit: 19s without the hard drive attached.
Man, you must have no crazy peripherals. My workstation takes longer than that to just get to the point of looking for the OS. The LSI SAS controller, Chelsio 40GbE NIC and even the onboard Intel NIC take their sweet time to initialise. My servers take even longer from a cold boot for live diagnostics, power management, cooling control, and the peripherals all do their thing. Floppy boot times weren't really all that bad compared to the time it takes for peripherals to start (of course the system is much faster when it's actually running, and you don't shut down very often).
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Re: Finally finished moving system
[Re: Vas Crabb]
#347885 - 12/08/15 06:06 AM
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> > Edit: 19s without the hard drive attached.
>
> Man, you must have no crazy peripherals. My workstation takes longer than that to
> just get to the point of looking for the OS. The LSI SAS controller, Chelsio 40GbE
> NIC and even the onboard Intel NIC take their sweet time to initialise. My servers
> take even longer from a cold boot for live diagnostics, power management, cooling
> control, and the peripherals all do their thing. Floppy boot times weren't really all
> that bad compared to the time it takes for peripherals to start (of course the system
> is much faster when it's actually running, and you don't shut down very often).
Well, I'm pretty sure it was longer than 19s to the Wise Care prompt. After all, Wise Care can't really start counting before the OS even loads. Still, it is much quicker than from the HDD.
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| Qun Mang |
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Legend of Link
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Re: Finally finished moving system
[Re: Traso]
#347886 - 12/08/15 06:11 AM
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> You can rename the drives, which takes a hell of a lot less time than re-doing your
> links. That's another reason I partition my drives, so that the back-up/ghosting is
> exactly the same...although I think you can dictate this at run-time, either way.....
In some cases, yes. However, everything was on the C: drive before. Now, only the OS is on the C: drive. Changing that to a different drive letter and calling the non-boot drive C: would have caused more of a pain than a few shortcuts I am sure. The interesting thing is the HDD is now E: which was what partition my emulation folder (the one that's taking over a day to copy over) was on an older computer.
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Stiletto |
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They're always after me Lucky ROMS!
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Re: Finally finished moving system
[Re: Qun Mang]
#347897 - 12/08/15 09:11 PM
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I've offered to do the SSD conversion to my father's old desktop, so I'm definitely following along what people are doing so as to plan my attack. But first I need to repartition his old drive so as to get all the data files onto one partition and the OS/programs onto another partition, and I have a feeling that's going to take a really long time.
- Stiletto
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Floppies?.....whatever for? (nt)
[Re: Vas Crabb]
#348010 - 12/12/15 01:03 AM
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Scifi frauds. SF illuminates.
_________________
Culture General Contact Unit (Eccentric)
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| Qun Mang |
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Legend of Link
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Re: Finally finished moving system
[Re: Stiletto]
#348066 - 12/13/15 07:56 AM
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> I've offered to do the SSD conversion to my father's old desktop, so I'm definitely
> following along what people are doing so as to plan my attack. But first I need to
> repartition his old drive so as to get all the data files onto one partition and the
> OS/programs onto another partition, and I have a feeling that's going to take a
> really long time.
>
> - Stiletto
It literally took days to copy over a 600+GB folder with some 440,000 files between a USB3 HDD and the internal hard drive. Part of that though, I discovered, was Directory Opus would stop copying files when I locked the computer (Win+L) to prevent unauthorized hands from messing around with the computer when I was away from it. Or it could have been from the YoWindow screen saver- I never figured out which.
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Re: Finally finished moving system
[Re: Qun Mang]
#348075 - 12/13/15 09:19 PM
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> It literally took days to copy over a 600+GB folder with some 440,000 files between a USB3 HDD and the internal hard drive. Part of that though, I discovered, was Directory Opus would stop copying files when I locked the computer (Win+L) to prevent unauthorized hands from messing around with the computer when I was away from it. Or it could have been from the YoWindow screen saver- I never figured out which.
That should've been a few, maybe several, hours via that protocol. I'm pretty sure it was the former; hibernation mode. Should've locked the room.
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